The Union Q&A: Ruth Poulter, Nevada City council
This is the ninth in a series of question-and-answer sessions conducted by The Union’s Editorial Board with candidates for Nevada County supervisor and the Nevada City City Council.
Ruth Poulter , 52, is a native Nevada Citian, a real estate agent, and a member of the city’s Planning Commission. Her Web site is nccitycounci.com, and her phone number is 265-0650.
The Union: Give us a little bit about your background.
Ruth Poulter: I’m a native. I was born in Nevada City, and I’ve been here 52 years. I owned Posh Nosh restaurant on Broad Street in Nevada City for about 10 years, and I’m currently working for Coldwell-Banker Grass Roots Realty as a Realtor.
I’ve served on the Chamber of Commerce as a board member as well as its president; vice president of the Economic Resource Council; founding member of the Chinese Quarter Society; founding member of the Joe Cain Society; and currently I serve as a planning commissioner for Nevada City. I’ve been doing that now for about seven years.
The Union: What prompted you to run for the City Council this year?
Poulter: I’ve always been very active in the community and I’ve served on the Planning Commission for several years now, and I’m just ready to move into a different position in Nevada City as a City Council member. I ran once before and lost miserably four years ago. I just wasn’t quite ready then, and now I feel that I’m ready to actually take on the responsibility of being a City Council member.
The Union: Where do you think you came up short in that campaign?
Poulter: I didn’t try hard enough.
The Union: More door-knocking needed ” more appearances?
Poulter: Yes, basically that – I did everything else, but I really didn’t go around the neighborhood as much as I could have and should have. I thought that my name recognition might do more for me than it did. Or maybe it did, I don’t know.
I am just really passionate about it this time; I really want to serve on the Nevada City City Council.
The Union: Is there a particular issue that stirred this passion?
Poulter: Tom Balch decided not to run for re-election, so currently the way the City Council is set up is you’ve got Tom Balch, Steve Cottrell, and then you have Kerry Arnett, Dave McKay and Conley Weaver. Over the past four years it’s been pretty much a 3-2 vote. Sometimes there’s a swing vote that would take it from the position of Steve and Tom versus the position of the other council members.
What concerns me this time is that Tom is leaving, and there is a real good chance you would have a City Council that is a 4-1 vote, and you’ll also have a Planning Commission that’s a 4-1 vote. Because Dave McKay is supported by Paul Matson and Laurie Oberholtzer and those folks, as Sally Harris is. That’s a concern of mine, that we will have a 4-1 vote on both the commission and the City Council.
The Union: So the goal for you is that and Steve Cottrell will be on the council and in a position where occasionally you can persuade one of the other three?
Poulter: Right. Which is basically what’s happening on the Planning Commission these days. Harry Stewart and myself are in one position, and the other three commissioners are in another position.
The Union: And because the council members appoint their counterparts on the Planning Commission, they affect that?
The Union: If you look back, say, 10 years or so, what are the issues that were important to Nevada City then as compared to the issues you feel will have to be dealt with in the next 10 years?
Poulter: I don’t think the issues are that different. Ten years ago was when I owned my restaurant. I was involved then with the Chamber of Commerce and with the Economic Resource Council and the Joe Cain Society, and my main concern was that Nevada City was not doing enough to support downtown business, as well as support an organization like the Economic Resource Council to help our business community.
Back 10 years ago, Nevada City didn’t even have a representative on the Economic Resource Council when it was starting up. I was on the chamber board at that time, and requested that the board appoint somebody, and that we start going to these meetings. They said, “Sure, you can be appointed.” So I was, and I started going to these meetings. We were never represented by anyone from City Hall. The city manager wasn’t there, and there wasn’t a City Council member there at all. Now there is. That’s changed over these past 10 years.
The reason I got involved with the Joe Cain Society is because January, February and March can be very slow times in Nevada City. Being a business owner, you look for ways to promote business and to bring people to town. And as everyone knows, that was usually successful. It’s no longer organized by the Joe Cain Society; it’s been turned over to the Chamber of Commerce.
But we accomplished the goal, and there was a lot of opposition to that. The City Council was opposed to it; we had to fight for street closure. And they had their reasons. They felt they have a limited staff, and I understand that. For the first few years, they requested that the Joe Cain Society go out and clean up the streets, and they were messy after a Mardi Gras event, as you can imagine. So we were out there picking up bottles and cans and beads, and it was crazy.
But then they saw the benefit to having the event, because it was drawing 22,000 tourists to our community. That brought in all the money ” the inns were all full, the motel rooms were all full, and my restaurant was just crazy.
Towards the end of the time that the Joe Cain Society was handling the event, people were coming into Nevada City as early as Thursday because we organized the window contests and all that. But the business owners in downtown Nevada City had to really fight to make that happen. We didn’t have representation on the Economic Resource Council. Those sorts of things really concerned me.
Another thing that is similar to 10 years ago is, of course, the historic preservation in downtown. And we have to maintain that, but we have to do it in such a way that we’re promoting business as well. I don’t feel we necessarily do that often.
The BID, the Business Improvement District, is an excellent idea. When I was serving on the Chamber of Commerce, we tried to implement it back then, and we had such huge opposition from City Hall that it just went away, because you can’t fight City Hall, right? So I’m very encouraged that it’s come back and is actually being supported now by our city manager and other business people downtown, which I think is wonderful. I will
support the BID as well.
The question has often been asked, if you support the BID, how is that going to be cohesive with the Chamber of Commerce? They serve two very separate purposes. The Chamber of Commerce is there to promote Nevada City, to run the events and make sure they have the volunteers and those sorts of things. That’s not going to change. The Business Improvement District, in my opinion, will be there to do the things the chamber isn’t doing, or can’t do.
An example of that is in Grass Valley, their downtown association. They all got together and put up all the lights that are on top of the buildings for Christmas. In Nevada City, we had to go to every business owner and beg them to put up the lights. That takes your focus off what the Chamber of Commerce ought to be doing. We shouldn’t be out there with our hands out, saying “Please give me $50 to put lights up.”
The Union: Is it difficult to serve that dual role of visitor bureau and chamber? Would this BID be more of a business advocacy group?
Poulter: Right. They would do the things like the sidewalk cleaning, go after grants to do things ” maybe to improve the sidewalks, maybe to plant some trees. The Chamber of Commerce can do what they do well, which is the events in Nevada City.
The Union: Does the chamber have to go to the city for money?
Poulter: Yes. It does put you in a difficult position, and it also makes you angry when you can’t get cooperation. But I never had the impression that we were being held hostage. There just wasn’t enough cooperation.
The Union: How would this BID be funded?
Poulter: From what I understand, businesses would be assessed a certain amount. I don’t know what that amount is. It goes into a kitty, and I’m assuming there would be a board to decide how to spend the money. You’re required to belong. It’s part of the district. . . . City hall would be the one that would be collecting the money, because someone has to do it. That’s the most logical place; they’ve got the business licenses, and they know how to contact these folks.
So it would be driven through there, and maybe they would get part of the money to help manage it in terms of the paperwork aspects of it. But the money would be managed by a board, and I would assume probably someone from City Hall would most likely be on that board.
The Union: Regarding the conflict between the desire for historic preservation and trying to stimulate business downtown, are you referring to some of the onerous regulations? Such as you want to do something as simple as replacing a window and have to go back 10 times for approval?
Poulter: Well, you shouldn’t have to go back ten times for approval. That’s one of the big problems.
The Union: They just keep moving the target?
Poulter: Yes, and that’s a big problem. A lot of the approvals ought to be handled by City Hall; they don’t necessarily have to come to the Planning Commission.
The Union: It shouldn’t come down to a personal preference?
Poulter: It should never, ever be personal. And it should never, ever be anybody’s personal agenda, or what I want Nevada City to be like. We have zoning ordinances, we have design guidelines, and most of them are pretty clear. If it’s just something general like you said, to change a window, it says right in there it needs to be a wood window.. . .
The Union: So decision-making has been arbitrary at times?
Poulter: Oh, absolutely. A lot of these decisions could be made by a city planner, which now we don’t have one. And they are not going to replace him right away, which is bizarre to me. I haven’t had an opportunity to ask [city manager] Mark Miller what he’s thinking about all that.
The Union: Maybe he’ll just let [Planning Commission chair] Laurie Oberholtzer make all those decisions?
Poulter: Well, trust me, she will be. She’ll be right in the middle of that, and so will [city councilman] Conley Weaver and the people that try to control what’s happening in downtown Nevada City. And not just downtown now. We’re spreading out to the non-historic district with tighter rules and regulations.
A good example of that is the recent light industrial issue that came up with Lance Amaral’s building. He got his approval, but as soon as that meeting was over, what does Laurie Oberholtzer say? “We need to look this over because we need to tighten this up.”
You know, Harry Stewart and I were on the committee and we went and talked with staff, and we talked with Lance Amaral who owns the building, and we talked with some of the tenants of the building. I went out there and made notes about the businesses that were out there in our industrial park, which is off Gold Flat Road. There were 13 of them, and only one, based on what I could tell, was doing anything light industrial. Everyone else is office professional out there right now, serving that sort of purpose.
I called Sierra Adoption Agency, and I called FREED, because FREED is interested in moving into Lance’s building. Sierra Adoption Agency has a payroll of almost $1 million, and FREED is somewhere in the $300,000 range. Well, what’s wrong with that? I just don’t understand.
Our recommendation was that it says right there in the zoning ordinance, “office and professional.” Conley Weaver made the statement at a meeting that we had with the staff . Why he was there is still beyond me – he’s now the “liaison to the Planning Commission.” Who decided we needed a liaison, I don’t know. But again, that’s a matter of people wanting to control everything that’s going on in Nevada City.
They kept coming up with, “It was always the intent of the ordinance that ‘office and professional’ needed to be related to light industrial.” Well, you know what? It’s been my experience, serving on the Planning Commission as long as I have, that the intent changes every time certain people want it to change. It’s their interpretation of it, depending on what’s on the table. And that’s inappropriate.
The Union: [Councilman and candidate] Steve Cottrell said he’s concerned that this whole planning process, the general plan, is really down to maybe two or three people, and that the community should be involved in that process. Would you agree?
Poulter: Absolutely. The housing element was written by two people, Laurie Oberholtzer and Dave McKay. And they’ve got the votes. They’ve got the votes on the Planning Commission and they have the votes on the City Council. And that’s what really concerns me. They have the votes now with 3-2, and it’s very possible they’re going to have a 4-1, 4-1. Everybody just better pack their bags and move on over to Grass Valley.
The Union: What is your position in regard to affordable or workforce housing in Nevada City?
Poulter: The median price range for a house in Nevada City as reported in The Union is $300,000. So affordable housing in Nevada City is almost a joke. I know you covered this thoroughly with the cohousing project, and that is the only affordable housing project that is going on in Nevada City currently. It is workforce housing, and I’ve met with a lot of the people that are going to be living there, and they are teachers and they are firefighters and so on and so forth – but those start out at $250,000, and that’s for a little condominium. . .
The Union: Do they have to share a bathroom?
Poulter: I don’t know – maybe it’s like on “Ally McBeal” with unisex bathrooms. But that project is there, and we had to fight very hard for that. But Dave McKay was against that project and so was Laurie Oberholtzer. Now, of course, Dave is a champion of it.
The Union: And there are the Sheatsleys, who were upset at the handling of their small project up on Nevada Street.
Poulter: Right – they tried to hold them hostage. “We’ll give you your additional unit, but we want you to do these things.” These things happen in architectural review committee meetings. If you come to a Planning Commission meeting, you don’t see what’s going on at the ARC. At the ARC, it’s that give and take kind of thing – “Yes, we’re willing to do this, but how about you don’t do that.” They bring that to the Planning Commission, and unless the applicant stands up there and says ,”That’s the way I wanted it to be,” then we don’t know what’s going on in ARC meetings, and neither does the public.
The Union: Who is on the ARC?
Poulter: ARC committees are selected by the chair. And Laurie Oberholtzer is currently the chair, and she selects all of the committee and she serves on the majority of them. I was in shock when she appointed Harry and I to look into the Lance Amaral one. I had given up being appointed to a committee, because Laurie and I don’t typically see eye to eye. So it’s usually Laurie and Victor [Prussack] or Evans [Phelps] – Evans and Laurie served on the ARC for the co-housing.
The Union: Is there anything the council can do – even with a majority at some point – to foster more workforce housing in the community?
Poulter: The only way you’re going to be able to do that is if you go out into our sphere of influence to actually build units. In Nevada City, within the city limits, the co-housing group is pretty much the last large parcel that we have. To go out from there, you’re going to have to go to Gracie Road, where the old saw mill is. There has been a lot of talk about working on that, to have that multifamily.
The Union: Would you be in favor of expanding the city to be able to give yourself more area to offer that type of housing?
Poulter: If Nevada City wants to have the money to keep their infrastructure going and they want to have a place to build additional housing, you’re either going to have to annex, or the citizens of Nevada City that live within the city limits are going to have to pay for it.
The Union: What’s your sense of the community on that issue?
Poulter: I’m sure most people would not be in favor of annexing anything into the city of Nevada City.
The Union: Conversely, then they would be in favor of paying more for services or infrastructure improvements, and thus driving up the cost of the existing property even further?
Poulter: That’s the only way you can do it. Somebody has to pay for it. Money doesn’t grow on trees, not even in Nevada City.
The Union: Talk a little bit about infrastructure changes that are needed.
Poulter: The sewer plant has to be upgraded once again, even though several years ago we thought we had this super-duper plant that would last us forever. Because of the new regulations with the state of California, it has to be improved and it’s going to be a costly project. I guess, from what I understand, we have $2 million and we need $4 million. So it seems to me that there’s going to have to be an increase in our water bills to pay for it.
The Union: It was mentioned that the city still has some 19th century water lines.
Poulter: What’s beneath the earth, yes, there is a lot of clay. The one that leads into my home – I live on Nevada Street – is clay, and I’m constantly fighting with it failing. My sewer line, yes. But the city currently doesn’t have the money to fix those things, and we’re not going to be getting any money from the state of California, obviously. So there is going to have to be some way to raise more money, and it is going to have to be higher rates. Sorry – I probably just lost the election there.
The Union: Aren’t you running the risk that Nevada City will become more of an elitist community of wealthy people, putting up barriers to moving there?
Poulter: If anybody is going to put up barriers to anybody else, it’s going to be the Planning Commission or the City Council. It’s not going to be because we raise rates a little bit. I live in Nevada City, and I’ve been there for 52 years, and the people that live in Nevada City are a very diverse group. There is nothing elitist about Nevada City whatsoever.
The Union: You say it hasn’t been exclusionary, but you say the general plan update didn’t provide for community input.
Poulter: Well, Steve Cottrell tried but he got voted down, so it didn’t happen.
The Union: If you and Cottrell are both elected to the council, will you help him become mayor?
Poulter: Sure. There’s absolutely no reason that Steve Cottrell should not have been appointed as mayor in Nevada City. It’s personal. It’s absolutely personal. At the KVMR debate, [councilman and candidate] Dave McKay said (and I won’t get it verbatim, so excuse me for that) that you have to go after your other two votes to get elected mayor. Well, does Dave McKay know that that’s a violation of the Brown Act to go after those two votes? Is that how he got his three? You know, it’s just silly that Steve Cottrell has not served as mayor. But when I get there, I’ll probably vote for myself.
The Union: Would you agree that a community visioning assessment project would be a good idea?
Poulter: Again, Steve Cottrell tried to put that together serving on the council and has never been able to do that. But I would agree that we do need that. There’s no public input currently happening in the city of Nevada City. It’s being controlled by a certain group of people.
The Union: Is any of that due to apathy on the part of citizens?
Poulter: I don’t think people fully know the way that these decisions are being made. Nevada City doesn’t even have a website yet. I mean, hello?
When I served as chair of the Planning Commission, I made my point very clear at meetings. I tried to get the word out that this is happening: “People, you need to come to these meetings and get involved and pay attention.” And it got me thrown off as chair. Because that was back when the 80-unit project was coming up, and so I was thrown off.
But that’s the way you get these things done; you have to get people involved. That’s how I’ve always done whatever I’ve done. When I served on the chamber board, I formed committees – the Chinese Quarter Society, the Joe Cain – you get people involved and you make things happen.
The Union: How do you propose to do that if you’re elected?
Poulter: If it’s a 3-2 council again, what I would propose to do ” and the only thing I can do ” is that Steve and I would work together on specific projects that we want to implement, and get the word out, contact voters. I do have a website at nccitycouncil.com, and I intend to maintain that website once I’m elected.
The Union: The city’s Web page is pretty thin.
Poulter: The only explanation I’ve ever heard from city manager Mark Miller is that they don’t have the resources or the time to put one together. However, there have been people that have offered to help them with that. Applications and such should be online, where you can download them, fill them out and e-mail them back. The city is moving in that direction but, boy, they better hurry up.
The Union: You’re basically saying that it’s time for a change. If there is no change, where is Nevada City headed?
Poulter: Then it will be an elitist place, because it’s going to be controlled by a certain group of folks who have been controlling it now for several years.
The Union: What would that mean for downtown?
Poulter: I was born and raised here, and a lot of those buildings back when I was growing up were boarded up. Nevada City has come a long way since the ’60s, and we need to be moving forward. We can’t do that by putting our head in the sand. We cannot do that.
You asked about apathy by the citizens of Nevada City. Maybe they’re doing that ” putting their head in the sand and not paying attention to what’s going on. We’ve got to get people involved. There are ways to do that. You put an article in The Union, you have a website. You just get out there and you make it happen. The only people who are going to get out there and make that happen are the people that are not afraid to tell you what they want to do.
The Union: You are in the real estate business, but is there a problem that Broad Street will end up being lined with real estate offices?
Poulter: I don’t think that’s going to happen; it’s not just going to be real estate offices. I do hear a lot of people say things like, “We don’t have a drug store, and we don’t have a shoe store, and we don’t have this and we don’t have that.” But what’s happening in downtown Nevada City is what has kept us alive.
The businesses that are downtown are the businesses that are choosing to be down there. And to say you can only have X amount of real estate offices, or X amount of dress stores, or X amount of gift stores is not the way I want things to happen.
Nevada City is what Nevada City is. And Nevada City is this quaint little village where the shops are steered towards tourists at this point. I shop in Nevada City primarily, though. But I know that that’s the view of some people.
Nevada City is doing well, because people are paying their rents. There is only one building downtown that is currently vacant, and that’s because the owner decided to retire, and two artists are going to be going in there.
So that’s working, even if the rents are high. When I had my restaurant on Broad Street, my rent was high and it was hard to meet the bills every month sometimes. And that was another reason why you needed to do a promotion like the Joe Cain parade and those sorts of things. But you have to focus on locals. And when I owned my business, I focused on locals. I think Maiden Lane does that, and they are a very high-end store.
But Nevada City needs to become involved in things like the Economic Resource Council and those sorts of things. Out in the Gold Flat business district, there still are a couple of pieces of land they would like to develop. They’re not doing it because they are nervous about going to the city of Nevada City. They tell me that. That’s the atmosphere over there, and they deny it. Dave McKay denied it at the debate we had, and I was stunned.
The Union: Does downtown Nevada City have a parking problem?
Poulter: We have a thousand parking spaces, it’s just that sometimes you have to be willing to walk a little bit. . . . or buy a house where you can walk to town.
The Union: Councilman Cottrell has expressed concern that vandalism and crime are a problem in Nevada City. Is that something everyone should
be concerned about?
Poulter: I don’t know. I only know what I read in the paper. It’s obvious there is a problem, especially just this past week it has been unbelievable. If you talk to the police officers and such, I’ve never been given the impression that there’s something horrible happening in downtown Nevada City.
One of my campaign issues is to get back to a foot patrol in downtown. And the officers are in favor of that. Back when Bear was here – the German Shepherd with Dave Burke “there was such an uproar about having a dog walking the streets of Nevada City, I couldn’t believe it. And that was a great idea.
There’s a real problem at Callahan Park, and they’re not young people. These are folks that ought to have a job and they don’t, and they’re loitering around for whatever reason. It does feel threatening to walk through Callahan Park. I just walk right through, but I’m sure if you’re not familiar with the area, you might be threatened.
The Union: Do you have enough police in Nevada City?
Poulter: We have what we can afford, is what I’m told. But they need to get out of their cars, maybe? And they’re not opposed to that, from what I’ve been told by certain officers.
The Union: Who do you align yourself with?
Poulter: I’m an independent. I’m very good friends with Steve Cottrell, and obviously a supporter of his. He appointed me to the Planning Commission. But in the several years I’ve served on the Planning Commission, Steve Cottrell has never called me in once to try to influence my vote, to give me his opinion on what he thinks is going on or anything like that. Because he knows, just like I feel about him, that we’re both independent thinkers and we’re individuals, and we’re not attached to the hip of anybody.
The Union: What haven’t we talked about that you think is important for voters to know about Ruth Poulter?
Poulter: I stand on my record as a voter on the Planning Commission. I am independent, an individual. I’m running for this office just because I want to serve the community in a more common-sense way. Bring an application to the Planning Commission and let it go through the process the way it ought to go through the process, which is you follow the regulations, you follow the design guidelines, you follow the zoning ordinance, then no problem. We shouldn’t be designing people’s projects. And if you go to any Planning Commission meeting, it happens all the time and it’s just not right.
And I’m very concerned about the way the council and commission will stack up if Steve and I are not elected to the council. You’re going to have a 4-1 and 4-1 in my opinion. I don’t know Sally Harris very well. She seems to be a strong individual. However, she is being supported by Paul Matson and Laurie Oberholtzer, the same people that appointed the other three people currently on the commission.
The Union: Do you see Kerry Arnett as a swing vote on the council?
Poulter: Yes. Recently I’ve seen some of that in him, and I’m very encouraged by that. And if Dave McKay were not elected, and let’s say it ends up myself, Sally Harris, Steve Cottrell, Kerry Arnett and Conley Weaver – Sally is a newcomer, and hopefully she’ll listen more. Maybe. I hold out hope for that.
When Evans was appointed to the planning commission – she was appointed by Dave McKay – that made me very nervous and I threw up my hands and thought, oh well, here we go, stacked up again. It’s very hard to serve on a board or a commission where you already know what the vote is going to be before you get there. And the citizens of Nevada City have to realize that’s what’s going on. Evans has a couple of times gone in a different way; she hasn’t voted along with Laurie. I’m very encouraged by that. She was the swing vote on the co-housing. That would not have happened if she hadn’t done that.
The Union: Do you think that opposition to that project might have hurt that Laurie Oberholtzer’s power base?
Poulter: Yes. That’s one reason you don’t see Laurie so much involved in this current election. I think she is currently being viewed as a negative to a lot of people .
The Union: By folks who previously supported her?
Poulter: Oh, yes. Laurie is “The Machine” in Nevada City. That’s what she is affectionately known as.
The Union: Where does that power come from?
Poulter: She’s organized. Extreme organization, such as phone trees, the Rural Quality Coalition. They’re just extremely organized. Way back then, I thought they were on the right path, I don’t feel that now.
The Union: In regards to the Deer Creek Park II project near Nevada City, traffic a concern?
Poulter: Yes, it definitely would be my concern. The thing that was bizarre to me about that was how immediately certain folks on the City Council just came out and said, “No way, we’re going to hire an attorney, we’re going to do this,” without really seeing what the project is going to be. Lance Amaral threw out the highest number he possibly could for the whole shock factor, and he got it, didn’t he?
The Union: Well, he threw out his name, which would get the shock factor anyway, with some people.
Poulter: I grew with Lance, and “developer” is not a bad word.
The Union: But the traffic coming down Boulder would be problematic.
Poulter: Yes, it will be, and if people were willing to work together ” give Lance a call and say, “Hey Lance, maybe we ought to get together and talk about what might work better for Nevada City, see what you’re all about, see what our concerns are . . .” But what does the City Council in Nevada City do? They put up a fence and they say, “You know what? We’re going to hire an attorney and we’re going to fight it.” And they don’t even know what they’re fighting yet. That really discourages me.
The Union: There has been an EIR on the project. There is a lot of detail available.
Poulter: Right. But Lance has not presented the project the way that it’s going to be. It hasn’t been completely decided or drawn or whatever. My point is that the City Council should get involved in the project rather than saying, “We don’t want it, we’re not going to do it.” Rather than hiring an attorney.
The Union: Especially for a city that doesn’t have any money.
The Union: Do you consider Deer Creek to be an underutilized asset of Nevada City?
Poulter: Yes. I think that a trail along Deer Creek would be incredible. When I was growing up I lived on Jordan Street, and the path I used to walk on to get down to swim in the creek, they’ve blocked it off.
My understanding is the South Yuba River Citizens’ League is currently working on a plan with the Friends of Deer Creek to actually create more pathways down there. And there’s some good trout in Deer Creek. I’ve fished down there.
The Union: Would you like to close with anything?
Poulter: Just visit my website, nccitycouncil.com, let me know what you’re thinking out there, and give me a call and we can talk about it. And . . . vote for me.
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